29 responses so far ↓

• 1 gardenguy // Feb 22, 2010 at 10:32 am

  last week seattle times ran piece on why so few drug crime reportings by private citizens go unanswered, and the reply from police was because so few reportings contain information that can lead to an actual conviction, and that a lot of times what citizens think is a drug deal is actually not. I think what we should do when we see something is perhaps get in car and follow drug dealers while calling police, see if that works, or else try and take a picture that shows actual drugs so the prosecutors have something more to go on. In this instance, how do we know that these people were not meeting up to sell some small handheld item such as a computer chip that they had advertised on craigslist? it sounds silly but I think from the perspective of the police and prosecutors from the information provided above there is no actual proof that this was a drug deal and not some other type of legal exchange.

• 2 dave // Feb 22, 2010 at 10:46 am

  I have no problem believing this was a drug deal, BUT garden guy makes a good point about craigslist.

  I can’t count how many times I’ve purchased or sold something like a video game or a CD and met someone at an ATM, or out in front of their house, etc. and just made a quick, no-nonsense exchange. I’ve often thought, “if someone is watching this from afar and doesn’t know what I’m really doing, they might think I was up to no good.”

• 3 Neighbor // Feb 22, 2010 at 10:55 am

  There was “an exchange” of what?

• 4 E.S. // Feb 22, 2010 at 10:59 am

  Generally, legitimate exchanges don’t happen on *other* people’s lawns. If someone is being threatening on your property, it doesn’t even have to be a “drug deal”, just the trespass is illegal.

• 5 Judge Judy wannabe // Feb 22, 2010 at 11:27 am

  E.S. - Unfortunately, it’s not “Trespassing” if the guy was standing on the city-owned parking strip between the sidewalk and the street, or on the curb.

  The Seattle law regarding criminal trespass is geared toward private retail establishments and apartment buildings (private residences and yards are not mentioned), and states that the person be knowingly, unlawfully “in a building” or “upon the premises”.

  The trespasser must be notified that he/she is not privileged to enter or remain either verbally, by clearly posted sign, or both.

  So just walking or standing in someone’s yard isn’t trespassing until the person is told they are in fact not allowed there.

  I’m not trying to defend what took place in front of this woman’s house, but from a legal standpoint the police have nothing they can do unless they witness the transaction and come up with a reasonable cause to stop and search.

• 6 Jack Webbsite // Feb 22, 2010 at 11:52 am

  What was the color of the suspect SUV?

• 7 Citizen // Feb 22, 2010 at 12:54 pm

  I live North of 95th and a few blocks East of Greenwood. When I have seen something, like a car driving up and down our street. parking….going a block, parking again….coming back…..I called the police and an officer arrived a short time later for me to give them more detail.

  I have called about a trespasser in a neighbor’s yard and that got two cruisers in a matter of minutes.

  I don’t think it is accurate to say SPD won’t show up. If you listen to police/fire scanners they are busy with all sorts of crazy stuff going on about town.

• 8 Jack Webbsite // Feb 22, 2010 at 2:10 pm

  Monday, Feb 22, between 1PM and 1:45PM I watched some similar transactions on 1st Ave NW near 60th. Red Ford Escort SW with several young white males meeting other cars and handing something back and forth. Called-in the plates to the SPD, but suspects have gone.

• 9 Mike // Feb 22, 2010 at 2:28 pm

  I think it’s a great idea to start taking pictures of them. Let them see you do it. I have done this before.

• 10 Jack Webbsite // Feb 22, 2010 at 2:39 pm

  I did get a few pictures, but not with the suspects outside the cars. It’s hard to be discrete. There always a few people pushing strollers by while this is going on.
  Car one was a dark Grey Ford Explorer mag wheels, female driver
  Car 2 White Chevy four door Hispanic driver
  Car 3 Red Ford Escort SW, no hub caps, two white males, thin mid 20s
  Car 4 White Honda Accord two door

• 11 Mark // Feb 22, 2010 at 2:39 pm

  “Here’s an outrageous story of a drug deal in broad daylight in Ballard/Whittier Heights on Sunday.”

  Sorry to say, but in broad daylight is not that outrageous. I have watched from my kitchen window, front steps, right in front of me while doing yard work or even sitting in my own car right behind the suspect and catching eye to eye with the dealer as they drive by and the deal still goes down in broad daylight. It will get more prevalent as the days get longer.

  The best thing to do is still try and get both license plates and call them in to SPD. Who knows maybe we can get a running log of the cars on this website with 3/4’s of the license plates numbers

  I think we all know that the deals of CD’s and microchips are few and far between, but the drug deals are everywhere.

  If you see an unfamiliar car parked on your block, in front of your house for more than ten minutes, talking on a cell phone then most likely something is going down in a few minutes. Step outside with your pencil and paper and get the license plate just in case or have your neighbor across the street do the same.

  The idea is to remain safe and not do something stupid. So be smart and vigilant in your neighborhood.

• 12 Tim Flanagan // Feb 22, 2010 at 4:08 pm

  I like the idea of taking photos, and being obvious about it. Nobody can legitimately object, though they might not like it. I don’t like all the cameras watching me all around town, but my feelings don’t seem to make the cameras go away, somehow.

  If people do not want their photo taken, they shouldn’t venture into public. You have no expectation of privacy when you go out in public. You have no right NOT to be photographed.

  You have a right not to have your photograph published without your permission, but that’s a different issue entirely.

  I guess you might hesitate to photograph suspicious behavior because you’re afraid of reprisal, but if that’s the case, the struggle is already lost. You’ve surrendered the commons to criminals.

  That ain’t the case on my block, I assure you. We never see drug deals here.

  I’m always shocked by these accounts, because I can’t imagine this happening without neighbors stepping outside to offer assistance. “Everything OK? You guys need any help?” Then trust your judgement when they respond. Normal people normally respond politely to this sort of inquiry, even if it’s not welcome right that minute. Any other response demands cautious inquiry on your part, perhaps including taking photographs. Use your judgement.

• 13 Pat // Feb 22, 2010 at 6:12 pm

  Not that uncommon an activity, and it will likely get worse as the US transitions towards a drug policy similar to Canada’s. Anyone that has been to BC recently may have noticed that “illegal” drugs are easily available everywhere. Dealers and supply chains increase, and the whole process becomes more socially acceptable.

  Oh, and the boomers are all for it…
  http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35519187/ns/health-aging/?GT1=43001

• 14 anon // Feb 22, 2010 at 7:58 pm

  “I don’t know why so many here are so passive about the crime elements that comfortably go about their business in these parts with no fear of reprisal from law enforcement or otherwise. I’m really sick of it.”

  Shocked, I say. Shocked!

  Do people still think I’m a right-wing nutjob for advocating taking personal responsibility for your safety?

  Go ahead. Write down those license plate numbers. Take all the photos you want. Heck - camp out on your front lawn if it makes you feel better.

  But as long as the “touchy-feely” crowd, which I’d peg as about 95% of North Seattle, fails to recognize that this emerging breed of criminal really isn’t concerned much about being photographed, or having their license plate recorded, or even being confronted. Why not? Because they know the law better than most cops, they know Susie/Sam homemaker is scared (as outraged as s/he might be) of reprisals (with good reason), and they know that the worst that will come from getting busted by SPD is a overnight stay in jail (at worst) and more likely, a stern lecture not to be seen in the area again.

  But by all means - you folks start snapping photos and taking video (the media likes video better). You might be able to get some increased patrols that way, for little while anyway.

  Just make sure you have an extra set of tires for your car (I learned that one the hard way), and be prepared to fix a broken window now and then.

  But rest assured, it will get worse before it gets better.

• 15 The Parent who Posted // Feb 22, 2010 at 9:55 pm

  I’m the one who saw this. First of all, I’m actually encouraged by all the responses here. A few clarifications:
  -He was standing on the parking strip so I get it that it was probably not trespassing
  -Did I actually see the meth rock (or whatever it is)? No. Did I see a shady guy in sunglasses on my curb, hear a weirdo with messed up teeth waiting in a run down suv and see another car quickly pull up while some exchange between the 2 parties happen? Yes.

  I do understand (Gardenguy) the police might need something more to go on or they cannot really do anything. I’m big on civil liberties. That said, there is no doubt in my mind what transpired.

  What bothers me the most is that criminal elements feel so comfortable in these parts that they wouldn’t even consider moving their transaction up 100 yards to the alley behind the Sands so no one could see.

  But I don’t blame them, if I were doing that or car prowling or breaking into basements or garages, I’d feel at ease over here too.

  Mark is right, we should take action and be vigilant. Unfortunately, that doesn’t take the place of having an actual, consistent police presence here. Beat cops. Patrols. Community policing. Whatever, it just seems void of any law enforcement presence whatsoever.

  I’ve been here for a year and a half now and it does seem to be getting worse. But rather then just complain on a blog, I’d prefer to take it up with the people who can actually do something. So if anyone has any knowledge of beat meetings or someone in SPD we can contact to get police to come out and patrol, please let me know.

  Thanks for all the comments. It makes me feel a little better knowing I’m not the only one enraged by this

• 16 fred117 // Feb 22, 2010 at 10:41 pm

  Unfortunately, this is not a new or rare occurrence (http://www.myballard.com/2009/09/08/neighbors-say-no-to-drug-activity/). Some of us have been mildly successful in getting these “dealers of whatever they’re selling” to move. But you have to be persistent because they will return.

  The Swedes may not be able to publish their license but how about a more detailed description of the SUV? Call the police and let these guys know they’re being watched. Don’t let the Anon-ymous posters discourage you. Good luck.

• 17 anon // Feb 23, 2010 at 7:56 am

  Fred (and Parent…),

  Yes, I was snarky, but I’m not really not trying to discourage you from taking action - quite the opposite. I do think that taking photos and shooting video of these transactions is one element of fighting back - but it can’t be the only one.

  My point is simply that you need to think this through to it’s conclusion, and be prepared to follow it through. If you think taking photos and having a feel-good sit down with the SPD community police guy is going to solve the problem, wishing someone “good luck” is very appropriate. I’ve sat through several of those meetings where the SPD guy comes out and gives out “tips” like turning on your front porch light and trimming back bushes. He’s a joke, and his tips are circa 1950’s.

  Today’s criminals operate under a different set of rules, and as you’ve already seen, they’re pretty comfortable with them. People who have never lived in a neighborhood where fear and the real threat of violence are not fleeting experiences, but everyday reality, have a difficult time understanding what that is, and a harder time adjusting their perception accordingly when faced by that prospect. You don’t want to think your neighborhood might come to that, and so you ignore things hoping they’ll go away. When you can’t ignore them anymore, you turn to those you think can solve your problem for you - the police.

  But as time goes by, you’ll get frustrated, and then angry, because eventually you’ll learn that the police won’t solve the problem either, least ways not without activities that would offend your appreciation for civil liberties (which I share, by the way).

  So, I do encourage you to take those photos (and video), and engage the police as partners in your effort. But don’t have unrealistic expectations that this alone will rid the neighborhood of crime. These are passive activities. If you want to send a message that criminals are not welcome, you will have to form that block watch group of dedicated individuals who patrol your neighborhood, and yes, get in the face of the ne’er do wells, letting them know you will not tolerate their presence or activities. Some will get the message and find other hunting grounds. For the rest, you’ll need to be prepared to stand your ground.

  I speak as one who has gone through this process, and succeeded. I, like you, really didn’t think I’d have to face the same thing in this part of Seattle, of all places.

  If you don’t have the stomach for that, well, then good luck indeed.

• 18 Jack Webbsite // Feb 23, 2010 at 7:56 am

  We are somewhat worried that a dispute between the druggies might erupt into fighting, shooting or reckless driving while children are in the area. After all, they don’t care about the neighborhood.

• 19 christy // Feb 23, 2010 at 9:17 am

  To The Parent that Posted–Police will happily come to a block watch meeting that you organize, or a larger meeting (we had one at the library) that you set up, to discuss these issues. It’s really interesting to get their perspective, and to learn what they can or can’t do. But these things only happen if you set them up. If you aren’t involved with GAIN (Greenwood-Aurora Involved Neighbors), you might want to become involved; if you don’t have a block watch, you should start one.

• 20 christy // Feb 23, 2010 at 9:18 am

  Oh, I just saw that you are in Ballard. I don’t know if there are groups similar to GAIN there, but you could find out, or you could start one.

• 21 Tiktok // Feb 23, 2010 at 3:29 pm

  Drug deals in broad daylight happen on my corner all the time. I’ve called the cops, they’re not going to do anything. Even if they came racing the moment I called 911, the deals go down in under a minute, and then both parties are gone.

  My neighbors are oblivious–the other day I was walking my dog when I came across a deal going down. The owner of the house came home (she’s a school teacher), parked her car, came out said ‘hi’ to me, chatted for a few seconds, then headed indoors, completely oblivious to the drug deal going down 20 feet away.

  Nothing’s going to change until people start getting killed.

• 22 Jack Webbsite // Feb 23, 2010 at 3:40 pm

  Tiktok, where is this happening? What location?

• 23 Tiktok // Feb 23, 2010 at 3:49 pm

  82nd-84th on 6th Ave

• 24 kim // Feb 24, 2010 at 4:58 pm

  because people that read these blogs and live in this area (not you i can gather) want to legalize certain drugs. our representative for our district is trying to pass a bill to legalize it. i’m w/you on this one but hey, this is seattle…..keep up the good work. persistence will pay off.

• 25 Tiktok // Feb 24, 2010 at 6:03 pm

  I don’t think I’m seeing pot deals.

• 26 Jack Webbsite // Feb 25, 2010 at 11:25 am

  Hey druggies, whatever you are selling, people in the neighborhood are watching and reporting it to the police.

• 27 that drug dealer :0 // Feb 28, 2010 at 9:26 pm

  This story is just pathetic…cry moar.
  Writing down your really interesting eyewitness account of an actual drug deal!, wont change a thing.

• 28 Jack Webbsite // Mar 1, 2010 at 9:07 am

  Yo, that drug dealer :0
  Well, the Seattle police have photos and other info for their file. Ha ha ha

• 29 Wanda Fooka // Mar 2, 2010 at 9:26 am

  Cocaine usually makes the user feel euphoric and energetic, but also increases body temperature, blood pressure, and heart rate. Users risk heart attacks, respiratory failure, nose bleeding, strokes, seizures, abdominal pain, and nausea. In rare cases, sudden death can occur on the first use of cocaine or unexpectedly afterwards.

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